Re: Graphic converter query - transparency

Woody <usenet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:

> Rowland McDonnell <real-address-in-sig@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> 
> > Woody <usenet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> > 
> > > Rowland McDonnell <real-address-in-sig@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > It's a question I would have thought the manual would help me
with, but
> > > > it seems not.
> > > > 
> > > > Can anyone tell me how to make a (currently white) area around the
> > > > outside of an image into a transparent region using Graphic
Converter?
> > > 
> > > Although not a user of graphic converter, assuming it works in a
> > > similarish way to other things, you can only change an area to
> > > transparent if you want to make a gif, which I assume you don't if
you
> > > are making an icon.
> > 
> > I dunno - I recall icons with transparent (missing, more like) bits
> > under < OS X, so why can't I have 'em with OS X?
> 
> Well, you can, but that isn't what the finder uses for transparent
> images (I don't think). 

Well, with ResEdit, you could define a mask to blank off regions of the
icon square that you didn't want to count as `part of the icon'.

Sometimes, this mask was used in an annoying fa****on so that the icon
had holes in it thus making it hard to click.

Sounds like `equivalent to transparency' to me - and one would assume,
in a sensible world, that the Finder would interpret transparent parts
of an image given to it to use as an icon as `masked off bits' in that
fa****on.

> Having a look now, if you click the tool in the toolbox that looks like
> a T crossed out that is on the right, 3 up from the bottom (this is
> version 6 - I guess it is old, it isn't something I use), you can click
> on a colour and all of that colour becomes transparent.

Ah - yes, so it does.  So why couldn't I find that mentioned in the
manual?  Hmm...

> > > the other way is to copy the part that isn't white and paste it into
a
> > > new transparency.
> > 
> > Okay, I need to learn what that means.  I've STFW and got horribly
> > confused.  Anyone got a pointer to a site I could read that'd teach me
> > what I need to know to understand this?
> 
> What I meant is that if you have a large area around the outside of an
> image that is white, if you select everything that isn't white (ie, the
> rest of the image) and copy it, you could paste it in a new transparent
> image.

Uhuh - damned awkward to do in practice, though, isn't it?  I don't see
how I could do that job competently and I have tried using the lasso
tool.

> When you say new image, there is a check box for transparent background.

Ah!  Yes - thanks.

> > > > (I'm trying to make an HP32E icon for the 32E emulator from here
> > > > <http://www.bartosiak.org/nonpareil/index.html>
- scanned in my
> > > > calculator, cropped in close, but I'm left with a bit of a border
> > > > because the sides are curved and I'd like it transparent)
> > > > 
> > > > And while I'm at it: what's the approved method of applying a
custom
> > > > icon as a one-off in OS X?
> > > 
> > > Copy and paste into the Get Info. I did it yesterday so I know it
works
> > > ok (this was 10.5, but I remember it always working).
> > 
> > It worked, but not okay - as I related.
> 
> By worked, I meant it worked ok here.

Righto.  But clearly what you did was significantly different to what I
did, 'cos it worked badly here.

> I don't tend to have custom icons but I reinstalled my wifes macbook to
> try and cure the wifi issues (it didn't) and she has them all over the
> palace

All over the palace, eh?  Moved up the property ladder, then?

> > > > I tried the obvious `Get Info' and then found I could paste my
prototype
> > > > image in if I selected the icon in the top left - but although I
gave it
> > > > a 128x67 pixel image, what I got ended up much lower resolution
than
> > > > that and it's all blurry.
> > > 
> > > What said 128x67?
> > 
> > Nothing, but I was working on the idea that the OS could sort it out
if
> > the image it was given wasn't square.  Was that wrong of me?
> 
> I don't know. It would appear from your experience it was.

I'd like to find out what it was playing at.

> > > Icons should be 128x128 32 bit argb (or is it rgba)? 
> > 
> > Dunno what that means at all.
> 
> 128 pixels square, with 8 bits used for red, green, blue and an alpha
> channel.

Ah - righto.  Now to find out what an alpha channel is.

> > > I use the icon tool, paste it into that and save it as a graphic.
> > 
> > Umm.  `The icon tool'?
> > 
> > > I am not sure if icon composer is a normal thing or gets installed
with
> > > the developer tools. I think it is.
> > 
> > You think it is what?  I don't have anything on my boot volume called
> > icon composer.
> 
> No, I checked, it is part of the development tools.

Righto.

> > > You can do it in photoshop so I am
> > > sure you can do it in graphic converter
> > 
> > I'm confused.  You seem to be telling me to use some special tool
called
> > icon tool or icon composer (which I don't have) and also Photoshop or
> > Graphic Converter.
> 
> No, I said I did it in either icon composer (which you don't have) 

I think I might well install the developer tools one of these days.  But
I've got a lot of setting up to do yet.  Just got MacTeX 2007 installed
and customised to my spec and my head hurts as it usually does when I do
that job.

>or
> photoshop.

which I can't afford and have almost no use for.

> However, I was guessing you could do it in graphic converter as well. I
> didn't know, as it is not something I use.
> However, I just did and it works. This is what I did.
> 
> In graphic converter I made an image of 128 x 128 with a transparent
> background. I made my image (just a rubbish image as a test).
> I then saved it as a tiff.
> I then got info on the tiff, selected the image at the top left and
> copied it. I then got info on a folder and selected the top left icon
> and said paste.
> The folder now has the custom icon.

That method worked okay here.  So now I have nonpariel-32e with a
scanned in image of my real HP-32E calculator as its icon.

<heh>  Four RPN calculators on DragThing (and another couple on
Dashboard).  And yes that does make some sort of sense.  One of them's
arbitrary precision, one of them's got a very nice UI so it's very nice
to use (via app or widget), one of them's a clone of the real pocket
calculator I've been using for the last 30-odd years, and the other two?
One of them's a clone of a *powerful* HP calculator, and the other's a
very space efficient widget with a rolling stack display that ought to
be useful but isn't as handy as I thought.

Still, I tend to grab the real calculator any time I need to do a bit of
arithmetic.  It's a lot quicker to use.

> > > > Thing is, that's what Mac Help appears to tell me to do.
> > > 
> > > Ahh.. never read that!
> > 
> > <shrug>  What else can one do?
> 
> Play around with it until it works generally.

I've tried that with Graphic Converter for many many years and you know
what?  I can't get it to work as I want.

In general, I learn pretty much nothing at all from playing around with
software in the absence of a good manual or someone to explain a bad
manual to me.

And you know that's the case.

Thanks for the ideas,
Rowland.

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